Microsoft quickly realized its Vista OS was a complete flop, and is actively developing its latest OS, Windows 7. As the popularity of netbooks continues to rise at an alarming rate, Microsoft is working on a netbook-friendly Windows 7, but the OS has several downsides that may anger some users.
Microsoft "Starter" will be able to run only three programs at a single time, will miss out on a number of Microsoft upgrades, and must pay for an upgrade if they want the normal user experience.
Microsoft officials defended Starter by saying it’s still robust and it’s more reliable on the netbook than current versions of XP.
Pricing details for Starter and its upgrade haven’t been released by Microsoft.
If you had the displeasure of running Vista on a netbook, be aware Microsoft made critical changes to ensure Windows 7 will operate somewhat smoothly on the small devices.
Windows XP dominated the netbook OS market in 2008, but Microsoft had to offer extremely cheap prices for the software, as Asus and other netbook makers also dabbled with Linux versions.
Considering Microsoft is continually feeling the heat from open source programs and the Linux operating system, it seems rather silly they’d roll the dice on Windows 7. I understand Microsoft is facing pressure from Google, Linux, Mozilla, OpenOffice, and numerous other software providers, but forcing customers to pay for an upgrade — especially in a market as hot as netbooks — seems like a horrible mistake.
Microsoft better hope reviewers who get their hands on Starter are able to confirm the idea that it still runs better than XP, even with severe limitations.
19 Comments
They didn't have a choice with Win 7. With XP this was a bit different in that they were peddling an older OS. Having said that, they had to lower the bulk price to 15 dollars in order to stamp out Linux growth in that market sector. ( I wonder how this affected any other vendor pricing wanting XP home for their platforms?)
It is a bit unpleasant to think that in their effort to dominate, they are charging HALF of what they charge for the OS for PCs offeered for learning purposes in third world countries! the one laptop per child program. I hope Gates can sleep at night....
But, with Win 7 - I always knew they would do something to hobble it or give it less value, as if they did not, folks would wonder why desktop versions were so much higher. Since they hobbled the hell out of it, I would guess the netbook vendors are getting quite a deal on 7.
the consumer on the other hand is going to get a superior OS than XP I think. for instance, i am already seeing reports of extended battery life on 7 over XP. For me, 3 programs open on a netbook is about all I would probably want. I am just curiuos about the annoyance factor when what happens when you open *or try* to open a fourth proggy.
It is a bit unpleasant to think that in their effort to dominate, they are charging HALF of what they charge for the OS for PCs offeered for learning purposes in third world countries! the one laptop per child program. I hope Gates can sleep at night....
But, with Win 7 - I always knew they would do something to hobble it or give it less value, as if they did not, folks would wonder why desktop versions were so much higher. Since they hobbled the hell out of it, I would guess the netbook vendors are getting quite a deal on 7.
the consumer on the other hand is going to get a superior OS than XP I think. for instance, i am already seeing reports of extended battery life on 7 over XP. For me, 3 programs open on a netbook is about all I would probably want. I am just curiuos about the annoyance factor when what happens when you open *or try* to open a fourth proggy.
- guest
- Posts: 15288
- Posted on: 21 Apr 09 02:41
I'm testing all the horrible Win7 versions i can get my hands on. And it's even worse than Vista. So sad they don't make the OS Better.
- guest
- Posts: 15288
- Posted on: 21 Apr 09 03:17
Paul Thurrott looked at this a couple of weeks ago. It's not really as bad as some people make it out to be.
http://community.winsupersite.com/bl...7-starter.aspx
With a netbook's limited resources, you're probably not going to want to run more than 3 apps anyway.
http://community.winsupersite.com/bl...7-starter.aspx
With a netbook's limited resources, you're probably not going to want to run more than 3 apps anyway.
Let's see:
- email
- web browser
- messenger
Want to open anything else, for example, something as simple as an image viewer, an image manipulator, a text editor, text processor, spreadsheet, etc, etc, etc? You're screwed, close something, maybe everything else and then you can continue working. When you finish with something, quickly close it as that's your only remedy to open something else.
I'm very doubtful this will be well accepted.
Netbook's limited resources? New models are coming which are becoming less and less limited and more power is just around the corner. Netbook's lack of power as a reason to implement this artificial limitation will simply not fly. Let the user decide if the machine has enough power or not. Forcing this simply because MS wants to extort more and more money will be a very difficult sell. If people were returning Linux netbooks before, wait when/if this reaches the market.
This netbook thing/craze is interesting but not so much for MS. For a long time, they've been able to sell their OS at extortiory prices (a monopoly is a great thing, if not for consumers...). Now with this low price machines, the price difference is so outrageous that they are on a bind, trying to decide what to do and not see their obscene profits plummet.
And, at the same time, we have XP which already provides a very good experience on netbooks... http://www.cdfreaks.com/jochem/../im...6/rolleyes.gif
By the way, the Win 7 taskbar is remarkably similar to Linux's KDE, isn't it? Of course it will probably be sold as another MS "innovation".
- web browser
- messenger
Want to open anything else, for example, something as simple as an image viewer, an image manipulator, a text editor, text processor, spreadsheet, etc, etc, etc? You're screwed, close something, maybe everything else and then you can continue working. When you finish with something, quickly close it as that's your only remedy to open something else.
I'm very doubtful this will be well accepted.
Netbook's limited resources? New models are coming which are becoming less and less limited and more power is just around the corner. Netbook's lack of power as a reason to implement this artificial limitation will simply not fly. Let the user decide if the machine has enough power or not. Forcing this simply because MS wants to extort more and more money will be a very difficult sell. If people were returning Linux netbooks before, wait when/if this reaches the market.
This netbook thing/craze is interesting but not so much for MS. For a long time, they've been able to sell their OS at extortiory prices (a monopoly is a great thing, if not for consumers...). Now with this low price machines, the price difference is so outrageous that they are on a bind, trying to decide what to do and not see their obscene profits plummet.
And, at the same time, we have XP which already provides a very good experience on netbooks... http://www.cdfreaks.com/jochem/../im...6/rolleyes.gif
By the way, the Win 7 taskbar is remarkably similar to Linux's KDE, isn't it? Of course it will probably be sold as another MS "innovation".
Seriously? Only 3 programs at once?
Hell, on a laptop .. I don't play games, I check email, windows messenger, surf the web, and play video's, and do many simple tasks simultaneously. That means something I have to give up on a windows7 based netbook.
And since netbooks AREN'T suitble for games, which is the only time I'd really use only be running 3 programs (games + email + internet) at once, I might as well use linux, which is free, I have total control over & has everything .. free, and every program I'd ever want inside the control panel.
Microsoft is really shooting itself in the foot. I hope they call this crappy looking version of Windows 7 something totally unrelated to "Windows 7", because it'll piss people off, look like crap, and turn people off the real windows 7 for their desktop machine.
And once linux is installed on netbooks, people might start to like it, and become familiar .. and before long, Microsoft will be losing business as people prefer linux.
Hell, on a laptop .. I don't play games, I check email, windows messenger, surf the web, and play video's, and do many simple tasks simultaneously. That means something I have to give up on a windows7 based netbook.
And since netbooks AREN'T suitble for games, which is the only time I'd really use only be running 3 programs (games + email + internet) at once, I might as well use linux, which is free, I have total control over & has everything .. free, and every program I'd ever want inside the control panel.
Microsoft is really shooting itself in the foot. I hope they call this crappy looking version of Windows 7 something totally unrelated to "Windows 7", because it'll piss people off, look like crap, and turn people off the real windows 7 for their desktop machine.
And once linux is installed on netbooks, people might start to like it, and become familiar .. and before long, Microsoft will be losing business as people prefer linux.
Most people still haven't got a clue about multitasking so this three app limit won't affect them however Windows 7 on a netbook is a crippled piece of junk. One is better off running a far superior and secure GNU/Linux OS as all the non-gamring functionality one needs is available out of the box for free.
Goodbye Microsoft, the Netbook market does'nt need your sloppy code and fascist DRM.
Goodbye Microsoft, the Netbook market does'nt need your sloppy code and fascist DRM.
- guest
- Posts: 15288
- Posted on: 21 Apr 09 19:21
"I hope Gates can sleep at night...."
Bill Gates no longer runs anything at Microsoft, and on top of that he has donated billions and billions of dollars to charitable causes in these 'third-world-countries.'
Maybe you unimaginative anti-M$ koolaid drinking drones can finally come up with someone else to point the finger at during your bash-Windows circlejerks.
Bill Gates no longer runs anything at Microsoft, and on top of that he has donated billions and billions of dollars to charitable causes in these 'third-world-countries.'
Maybe you unimaginative anti-M$ koolaid drinking drones can finally come up with someone else to point the finger at during your bash-Windows circlejerks.
"Goodbye Microsoft, the Netbook market doesn't need your sloppy code and fascist DRM."
Actually, it does. Most users don't have a clue about anything! And god forbid if anything goes wrong with a linux OS, those people are screwed, as Linux is still a nerd's OS, and that's the way nerds like it.
At least with windows it's wide spread & practically anyone with a few years of working on PC's can repair an OS.
Of course, most people won't get far if their netbook doesn't have an inbuilt CD/DVD drive
Actually, it does. Most users don't have a clue about anything! And god forbid if anything goes wrong with a linux OS, those people are screwed, as Linux is still a nerd's OS, and that's the way nerds like it.
At least with windows it's wide spread & practically anyone with a few years of working on PC's can repair an OS.
Of course, most people won't get far if their netbook doesn't have an inbuilt CD/DVD drive
- guest
- Posts: 15288
- Posted on: 23 Apr 09 15:55
MS has learned nothing from the Vista debacle. They take Vista, make it somewhat better, change the name so people will forget, slap a lucky number on it and hope. Then along comes netbooks throwing them a curve, so they dust off good ol' XP for the umpteenth time and hurl her at the budding Linux Netbook movement because Vista is too fat and Seven's not ready.
Then they decide to announce their own Microsoft Stores in the worst recession since the Great Depression and on top of that turn Windows 7 Starter Edition into a piece of useless sludge like Windows Vista Basic was. Plus they keep their seven billion versions instead of simplifying it.
Meanwhile , Apple reports a good profitable quarter in spite of the recession.
MS still doesn't get it. People won't like Starter on their netbooks. It will be another Basic. Remember all those lawsuits over Vista? In this economy, there are tons of lawyers who need work. They'd love to get a class action suit aimed against the Walmart of software with its fat deep pockets (and empty hollow brain). MS doesn't realize that "If you make a piece of crap, people won't buy it." DUH!
And in this economy, people want and DEMAND VALUE. If MS won't give it to them, Linux and Free Open Source Software will.
And there won't be no stupid three app limits those.
Then they decide to announce their own Microsoft Stores in the worst recession since the Great Depression and on top of that turn Windows 7 Starter Edition into a piece of useless sludge like Windows Vista Basic was. Plus they keep their seven billion versions instead of simplifying it.
Meanwhile , Apple reports a good profitable quarter in spite of the recession.
MS still doesn't get it. People won't like Starter on their netbooks. It will be another Basic. Remember all those lawsuits over Vista? In this economy, there are tons of lawyers who need work. They'd love to get a class action suit aimed against the Walmart of software with its fat deep pockets (and empty hollow brain). MS doesn't realize that "If you make a piece of crap, people won't buy it." DUH!
And in this economy, people want and DEMAND VALUE. If MS won't give it to them, Linux and Free Open Source Software will.
And there won't be no stupid three app limits those.
- guest
- Posts: 15288
- Posted on: 23 Apr 09 16:36
I don't think Microsoft can win. People buy low powered laptop computers (netbooks), then b*i*t*c*h because it will only run a limited version of Windows 7. If Microsoft didn't come out with the limited version, they would b*i*t*c*h that Windows 7 won't run on their netbooks. Spend a hundred bucks more for a real laptop, and don't worry about it.
I run a netbook with XP on flash and it's OK. I still have to try the Office2008 60 day trial and see how badly it performs. Vista is out and 7 I have my doubts about too. Linux is probably the best way to go with the underpowered ATOM. It seems to throttle down when on battery power alone.
Gee I can not wait for the ultimate omega version of 7 Hah!
Gee I can not wait for the ultimate omega version of 7 Hah!
The thing is: why would anyone want to run Win 7 on a netbook? What compeling reason would there be for anyone to want it? No one really cares or wants it. They are more than happy with what they have now, which, by the way, doesn't have this crazy 3 apps limit.
The only problem here is that MS wants to throw their new bloatware down people's throats, that's what it is.
The only problem here is that MS wants to throw their new bloatware down people's throats, that's what it is.
@Johnzap: Because MS is going to phase out XP and the OEM vendors want a Windows OS for their customers. Netbooks outsold desktops last year and over 90% of the buyers wanted Windows on the devices. MS extended the licensing temporarily, but I would suspect, but cannot be sure, that when 7 comes out MS will try like heck to pull the plug on XP.
Any Operating System that only allows 3 simultaneous programs is hardly even a toy as I see it.
Windows 7 Starter Edition is a non-starter in my book.
Windows 7 Starter Edition is a non-starter in my book.
*Keep in mind that some Microsoft "Tray-Applications" don't count in the 3 application limit*
Also be aware that Vista's (and likely Windows 7, since it's derived from Vista) power management for laptops/battery powered devices is far superior to the capabilities of the same in WinXP, and the devices should usually run significantly longer on a single charge.
I still don't understand what difference (besides political) it makes to M$ between dropping a fully capable OS onto the netbooks, versus a crippled OS.
Are they perhaps worried that people will buy a cheap netbook/portable with Windows 7 Ultimate (or premium versions), never activate it, but install it on a desktop machine instead? And then use linux on the netbook?
Seriously? WTF?
Only nerds would consider that - and then those people at the other end of the Activation Phone Line are very accommodating when you use the excuse that the motherboard died.
. I'm sure some enterprising nerds can find/have found a way to uncripple the starter/non-premium versions of the software regardless, and inclined nerds can easily find ways around activating premium versions of the software anyway, rather than splashing out for an entire netbook & OS.
There's really no point between any versions (except to extract additional cash from witless victims) ... windows should just ask a few simple questions at install time, query the hardware, and adapt it's usage of system resources/programs as necessary.
Crippled versions are just silly. It just amounts in bad advertising (for Windows 7) to the average Joe.
Also be aware that Vista's (and likely Windows 7, since it's derived from Vista) power management for laptops/battery powered devices is far superior to the capabilities of the same in WinXP, and the devices should usually run significantly longer on a single charge.
I still don't understand what difference (besides political) it makes to M$ between dropping a fully capable OS onto the netbooks, versus a crippled OS.
Are they perhaps worried that people will buy a cheap netbook/portable with Windows 7 Ultimate (or premium versions), never activate it, but install it on a desktop machine instead? And then use linux on the netbook?
Seriously? WTF?
Only nerds would consider that - and then those people at the other end of the Activation Phone Line are very accommodating when you use the excuse that the motherboard died.
. I'm sure some enterprising nerds can find/have found a way to uncripple the starter/non-premium versions of the software regardless, and inclined nerds can easily find ways around activating premium versions of the software anyway, rather than splashing out for an entire netbook & OS.
There's really no point between any versions (except to extract additional cash from witless victims) ... windows should just ask a few simple questions at install time, query the hardware, and adapt it's usage of system resources/programs as necessary.
Crippled versions are just silly. It just amounts in bad advertising (for Windows 7) to the average Joe.
Nobody will be bothered by the 3 app limit I don't think. Paul Thurrot has a decent writeup describing what it takes to trigger the nag screen. I would never get it on my netbook. As all I do is surf the net and listen to music at the same time. According to what I read at Thurrots site- I could open up a couple more apps or so at least.
Watch- people are gonna piss and moan about no Aero Glass in Starter edition. they wont even hit the 3 app limit in normal use.
Watch- people are gonna piss and moan about no Aero Glass in Starter edition. they wont even hit the 3 app limit in normal use.
@Crabyappleton: when I was saying "who wants" I was thinking about the customer. Not about what best suits MS... Anyway, this is all very simple: if MS wants to stay on the netbook market and their idea is to shove a crippled OS down people's throats, maybe they will be unpleasantly surprised with the end result. We'll see.
Johnzap- So was I. The customer wants Windows. The Linux netbooks were being returned at a high rate. All I am saying is XP runs fine on one gig of RAM- which is what a netbook comes with to hold down cost. I don't think Win 7 will "need" 2 gigs either. So when it comes out I am sure MS will want to retire XP.
Lets see what happens as we don't know yet. Either could be right. But, i got a feeing as I said before, people wont find the OS "crippled" as a netbook is not made for many open programs. I think the most bitching will be that they want the Aero Glass interface.
Lets see what happens as we don't know yet. Either could be right. But, i got a feeing as I said before, people wont find the OS "crippled" as a netbook is not made for many open programs. I think the most bitching will be that they want the Aero Glass interface.
- guest
- Posts: 15288
- Posted on: 08 May 09 01:12
I'm running XpPro by choice. I use it for my home studio post-production, email etc. But I still say that MacroSloth with Vista, is crap. Apple, If you like doodads and Gimmickry and paying way too much for everything, fine.windows 7 had better be some kind of uberprogramming wonder, or Linux and other OS Opensouce type progs will whip the pudding out of them. I'm Hoping they Do. I would much rather run a dedicated system for MY needs, without the shiny stuff . and without the Price, restrictions,and lack of cross compatibility, with hardware, software, and users. truth be told, I doubt it. I only hope that a better solution comes along, than apple or microsoft, without the learning curve needed with Linux., and I dig the Circle Jerks, great band
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