The joys of vinyl still lives on despite the music download boom

Agree. The problem is that a decent turntable coasts a small fortune, to get some decent sound.. Not to talk a valve Amplifier, Eloctromagnetic speakers.. Too much $$$ envolved....:S

I suppose the more people get fed up with all these new smart ass DRM schemes, the stronger interest they will show to the good old vinyl. Records gave in to CD IMHO mostly because of scratching which made it difficult and frustrating for archiving. However things may be coming back. There are turntables you can buy Now that use a laser beam to reproduce analog sound wave off the record without making any physical contact. They look more a mix of a steam engine with a solar panel, having a huge cd-rom like tray that rails out. They are work of engineering art and use five or so lasers to read a vinyl therefore being expensive and bought only by the elite audiophiles. I hope the technology will eventually become mainstream and when mass produced by Sony and such can make a comeback. The interest is there,vinyl still gathering dust- too heavy to throw out and next thing you know may be discovered in the loft and considered "hip", sorry, "cool", or "steep" or whatever the modern term is by a stray i-podder. Cheers

"certain harmonics lost on CD that records preserve, which gives records a warmer sound" Rubbish. Those harmonics are otherwise known as DISTORTION. Musicians for years have known that introducing distortion to your audio gives a "warmer" sound. But it's NOT an accurate reproduction of the original. All those vinyl record on sale today - guess what the master tape source was for them. Yep, that's right - DIGITAL.

"The problem is that a decent turntable coasts a small fortune, to get some decent sound.." No it doesn't. Sure, a valve amp will make it sound the best it can (and beat CD everytime) but, I can get perfectly decent sound from a second hand Technics SL 1700, a Technics solid state amp and a pair of nice B&W speakers. I even had a valve amp for a while and still went back to solid state.

""certain harmonics lost on CD that records preserve, which gives records a warmer sound" Rubbish. Those harmonics are otherwise known as DISTORTION. Musicians for years have known that introducing distortion to your audio gives a "warmer" sound. But it's NOT an accurate reproduction of the original." Dude, you never ear a turntable of €1000 up! Sorry. I did and didn`t ear that normal "creep" sound, normal on normal sub-systems, that we all still have at our homes.. Forget that crash.. And yes, vinly has up 24Kz up of frequency, than 16Kz on a CD..( someone help me here on the numbers and specifications..). Dont believe? Try ear music classic with the best system on a CD, tham go to the best system on a Vinly..:S I assure you, you will change ideas very fast... Quote: "I can get perfectly decent sound from a second hand Technics SL 1700, a Technics solid state amp and a pair of nice B&W speakers." technics? Nahh That is used for DJ`s!:+ Real audiophiles use stuff like Linn at same price, and other exotic models, that i have forget with time...but same price... Who can say, - i have already ear this stuff! Stuff: http://www.soundscapehifi.com/eurolab.htm - I assure, after return to our home, you can turn on your system sound.. I now because i did happen to me!:c

As much as I still treasure and carefully store my old LP's, the hassle of cleaning them, caring for the stylus, looking for half speed mastered/virgin vinyl products, etc. is not missed at all. Do vinyl lp's sound better than cd's. Compare a well done half-speed mastered virgin vinyl LP to a poorly mastered cd - and the lp will sound better when played on high quality equipment. But compare a properly recorded and mastered cd to the average everyday vinyl lp - and there is no comparison - the cd wins every time. And after repeated playing, the cd sounds the same and the vinyl lp slowly heads downhill. Then there is always the snap/crackle and pop that vinyl LP's eventually starts displaying. No thanks - LP's are dead. . . .

But that snap, crackle & pop were all part of that "warmth" and charm of vinyl. Especially when you get to the inner grooves, then the fun really begins! LPs are pure nostalgia (and Ebay fodder), and all the wishful thinking can't bring 'em back, except for a dedicated few hobbyists who's hearing exceeds that of mere mortals

"That is used for DJ`s" Then, that is your loss. They were making decks a lot longer than the SL 1200 (which I also have). Many of them use the same direct drive mechanism. There is nothing wrong with a Technics deck for music with a decent cartridge such as Shure. Also, makes like linn is overpriced rubbish.

You have to listen to records that were recorded prior to the 90's to hear how good they sound. If you have the chance, pick one of these up and then find the same album on cd, playit on a good system, and you will hear the difference, even if you ARE tone deaf. The click and pop can't be added to comparison, since that is damage done by use, the same thing if we scratch a cd, it will skip and screw up much similar to a record.

"Apparently, LP sales still accounts for 0.5% of all music sales despite the majority of retail and online stores only selling CDs" That's not it! LP sales are down because of piracy! We gotta act now to save the industry!

"Then there is always the snap/crackle and pop that vinyl LP's eventually starts displaying. No thanks - LP's are dead." No there isnt. Once again, if u use it carefully and fortunate enough to spend more on a lazer pickup turntable than on your car, there is no snapcracle and not much more of weartear than a CD. The price is still too hight to really sell them though. "That's not it! LP sales are down because of piracy! " Huh? I think Lp sales can only go up because of "piracy", unless u mean unofficial LP production. Cos those who buy LPs cannot be satisfied with shitty compressed downloads. But they probably use them as samples before buying the Real thing. "We gotta act now to save the industry!" Are you for real or is it your dark sarcastic side speaking?
[edited by FidelC on 12.03.2006 01:28]

Back in the "good old days" (about 1975) I bought 6 LPs from a downtown New York store -- right around the corner from city hall -- and when I got them home, they all sounded like AM radio -- every one a counterfeit! The more things change; the more they stay the same. :B

I'm pretty sure it was the joy of dark sarcasm
[edited by NexusHelm on 12.03.2006 23:54]

> That's not it! LP sales are down because of piracy! We gotta act now to save the industry! Heh, no, LP sales are down because most labels aren't making them. Can't buy what you can't find. Ergo the popularity of used record stores and indie music shops that still get new vinyl in. I praise any artist who still releases on vinyl because I'm still buying the wax.

The only reason LP is still going is because it's the prefered format for DJ's and anyone with decks who likes to have a mix now and again. CDs tried to push LPs out but like myself most DJs prefer LP as it's a more physical form of mixing and not just pushing buttons and sliding channels. As for all these other reason regarding warmth of sound etc, I personally think that's just waffle.

CD's are 44.1khz and 16bit which is very good quality. The problem with cd's released today is that the dynamic range of the music is compressed too much so that it volume in cd players will seem louder. If you listen to some cds where the producer didnt compress the dynamic range the music sounds much better but recently a lot of producers compress the crap out of the music so that the perceived loudness of the cd is higher this does the music absolutely no favors. I noticed this when i was listening to some early chilli peppers cd's the other day where the synmaic range was much better and sounded less compressed. The truth is there is a massive difference between a well produced cd and one thats made for people with 2 bob cd players with crap volume.

Vinyl has a higher frequency range than CD. It is not so much heard as it sensed. It is called Tenure. Many frequencies happen when playing a violin that the ear only senses. Vinyl uses audio compression to engrave playable grooves. Try any cd thru winamp & use the SQRSoft DSP ;imiter & you'll hear a simlar phenomenon. The RIAA eq curve does not allow the bass you hear to be recorded on vinyl so the eq in the playback system of magnetic phono cartiges make up for that with eq. That's a big reason for warmth. Of course the is a lot of physical things happening when a recorded is made & played back so that explains the nature part of it. Our ears ARE analogue. But the biggest fun of records, especially once you vaccuum them with a record vacuum or clean them even with windex or soap & water & a good rinse is just the fun of spending $20 bux on 20 records that just look cool or sound interesting from liner notes & having 5 or 6 excellent listening experiences. A lot of older records were made with a ton of expensive state of the art at the time gear that works with heat - like vacuum tubes which excite the music. Even most plug-ins are digitally modeling analogue recording equipment. There is nothing cool about scratchs is except that one can tolerate if one loves the music on the vinyl. As an vinyl lover - I love DVD-Audio!! The nasty part of vinyl is the rumble factor that hinders bass & the inability to clearly represent frequencies like 5hz which suggests that music such as techno or hip-hop greatly benefits from digital Cd's. I am still ever so greatful for the return of the 45 r.p.m. single through the medium of Mp3. Some of my friends like to clips of thier favorite songs as a ring tone thru a tiny 1" speaker in a cell phone. So in a sense digital technology has taken us back to the AM transitor radio days of the 1950's & 60's & 70's! Eek. I love Rio 300 original mp3 player & greatly look forward to i-pods being wireless to listen & watch Podcasts on demand. What I don;t like is the sound of XM radio.

Mordorr said: "Dude, you never ear a turntable of €1000 up! Sorry. I did and didn`t ear that normal "creep" sound, normal on normal sub-systems, that we all still have at our homes.. Forget that crash.. And yes, vinly has up 24Kz up of frequency, than 16Kz on a CD..( someone help me here on the numbers and specifications..)." Sorry, but no way. The ultimate limit of the frequency range on vinyl is the size of the stylus and the linear velocity of the groove. The outer grooves of a 12" record at 33 1/3rpm have a linear velocity of about .5m/s; the peak to peak size of a 20KHz wave recorded to the record would be about 25 microns. The very finest elliptical styli with a width of

I love it when someone corrects another person's waffle! LOL. Told you all this is technical crap. Does anyone really believe the average joe gives a damn about warmth etc..?? The only people I know buying vinyl are DJs.